Curse

markus_thom · Jul 17, 2006, 09:14 AM // 09:14

Okay guys and girls just getting an idea of what we can expect for future chapters and discussing whether or not old chapters will be revisited and expanded on.
I am aware that only two games have been published so far so keep in mind this is just a prediction of the very worst that could happen.

<<<Let’s just imagine if Anet decide to stick to the current formula>>>>
This was proven in how the past games were very isolated from each other and even affected economy. We saw many items worth dropping with the release of factions and with many it has stayed that way. I only play factions now due to the reason there is no reason to play prophecies anymore besides collecting skills and gathering titles.
And with each new release of each new chapter people will flock like geese to the newer chapters and the older chapters will be ghost towns.

So basically Anet decide to drop the old chapters into the ground and focus only on the new chapters when they are released. Meaning wasted opportunity on anets behalf to extend on storyline or game play mechanics which easily could have been built upon. What will happen to the faction system, with the release of the next chapter?
Will people forget about older chapters and just move on due to the reason we cant expect added content to previous chapters.

So after the release of chapter 5 we will have 5 different continents that’s unless anet decide to expand off previous continents.

<<<<The impact it will or could cause>>>>
Players of guild wars will be spread out across all the different landmasses, meaning it will be hard to find humans to team with, and outposts will be like ghost towns.

Previous flaws and lack of depth in storyline/game play will be left unsolved in previous chapters when it could have easily been implemented.

Sometimes expansions are needed; they can just release the patches/expansions for the previous chapters through the new games if they are worried about money and profit.

Too much isolation between chapters is a lame thing, why cant people see that?
It's like leaving a story untold. We need unity between the different chapters, such as story that carries on or flows or links to other chapters which could involve quests that link to playing more then one chapter.

Give the players something which makes each specific chapter worth owning besides individual titles and skill collecting. Make the chapters come toghter in other words

Paperfly · Jul 17, 2006, 09:59 AM // 09:59

It's a serious concern to the game's long-term prospects. In fact, I'd call it the largest obstacle predicted for around the time chapter four comes out.

...But I don't think your solution will help much. The newest chapter will always have the most people flocking to it just for the novelty value. Even a later chapter's flopping isn't likely to send a significant number of players back to older chapters.

ANet's solution so far has been to encourage people into PVP and PVP/PVE hybrid modes, with a certain amount of success. That has a nasty side-effect of reducing the breadth of their appeal slightly... Ah, we'll see where they stand in a year or so.

Xenrath · Jul 17, 2006, 10:00 AM // 10:00

Looking at Factions overall, I'd say they should have just released it as an expansion. Compared to Prophecies it's not really good enough to stand on its own two feet and feels much more like an expansion than a true sequel. This half assed "it's a standalone but it's also an expansion" isn't off to a good start at this rate imho.

Silent Kitty · Jul 17, 2006, 10:03 AM // 10:03

I think the Auction House will come with chapter three, and will not be available to other chapters.
I hope Guild Wars will get an off-line chapter too, but I think they are very happy how pugs work out now.

Arcador · Jul 17, 2006, 11:25 AM // 11:25

I hope they will somehow manage to implet the pvp to be some sort of combined - i.e. many more maps for TA, CA, HA, GvG, adding more war factions in the war (with new global maps etc) (the last one will be quite hard). Other wise it may really happen as the op predicted. Anet are smart people, I hope their designers know what to do.

Slainster · Jul 17, 2006, 11:33 AM // 11:33

its kinda sucky to think about.. I still love playing Tyria so much that i havent bothered to fully explore Factions yet.. when i do play in the factions world, I always come away feeling a little let down somehow...

Sily Wabbit · Jul 17, 2006, 11:36 AM // 11:36

one of my greater fears is keeping the game fresh. how many new skills can they come up with, how many skills can be duplicated? how many new pvp arenas can be made, how many new styles of missions can be introduced? how many new armor sets can be made, how many unique skins can be used? etc etc

I'm not seeing much life after Chapter 4-5 because this game lacks the system in which other MMO's use in which each new expansion increases the max dmg items can do, raises level caps, etc

Guild Wars doesn't have that. your never going to go past level 20. swords will always be 15-22. attirbutes will always be capped at 16 with runes. the game is going to get old, fast imo. there just won't be enough new content to make the game any more enjoyable then it already is. there can only be so much origionality, before stuff just seems to be reptitive and too alike to the point in which people just aren't gonna wanna play anymore.

0mar · Jul 17, 2006, 11:45 AM // 11:45

The biggest mistake Anet made was to make PvP and PvE integrated. If each side were seperated, then the PvErs could better weapons, more levels and more attributes. PvPers could get full unlocks, level cap and removal of the PvE advantages (armor switching, imba items and 4 weapons being a few).

Having them together makes GW a huge mess in which no one can tell what Anet wants to do. There's zero focus in either of these modes. PvE gets a boring mishmash of ideas with zero ability to progress upwards (ie capped weapons, capped levels). PvP has to go through PvE for unlocks or spend an eternity going for unlocks through faction and on top of that, has to get several PvE toons ready for PvP (armor switching and 4 weapons is a really big advantage).

Rent · Jul 17, 2006, 11:47 AM // 11:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sily Wabbit

one of my greater fears is keeping the game fresh. how many new skills can they come up with, how many skills can be duplicated? how many new pvp arenas can be made, how many new styles of missions can be introduced? how many new armor sets can be made, how many unique skins can be used? etc etc

I'm not seeing much life after Chapter 4-5 because this game lacks the system in which other MMO's use in which each new expansion increases the max dmg items can do, raises level caps, etc

Guild Wars doesn't have that. your never going to go past level 20. swords will always be 15-22. attirbutes will always be capped at 16 with runes. the game is going to get old, fast imo. there just won't be enough new content to make the game any more enjoyable then it already is. there can only be so much origionality, before stuff just seems to be reptitive and too alike to the point in which people just aren't gonna wanna play anymore.

Ladies and gentlemen of the court, may I present to you Exhibit A:

Nothing further, Your Honor.

Hengis · Jul 17, 2006, 12:13 PM // 12:13

My biggest concern over the long term path for Guildwars has to be the level and weapons cap limits.

In the first game and even in Factions, these limits made sense. Anet's policy of "no grind" to achieve maximum character level was great to get us into the game, but once the third chapter is released many many of us will have been level 20 for around 18 months or so.

I am sure the new content will be interesting and entertaining for a while, but I would still like a new target to aim for.

The titles have helped a bit too I guess, as I know I will be going for Grand Master Cartographer and Protector titles on the new continent, but what else are they going to add?

In Factions, the monster levels have been upped considerably from the first game, but that cannot keep happening in subsequent chapters or they will of course become impossible to beat.

I don't actually believe that they will ever raise the lvl caps, but it might just be possible for weapon levels to be raised in order to fight even higher level monsters. However, even that would probably change the metagame way too much for it to work.

Just some random ramblings.. LOL

Amity and Truth · Jul 17, 2006, 12:33 PM // 12:33

Well, even MTG implemented Abilities that you just couldn't fight without evening up the odds by upgrading your own deck. All those special attributes MTG introduced with each Edition raised the powerlevel of the game.

My personal grief with GuildWars is simply lack of communication. Yes we have Dev Talks and such but all in all the communicational link is lousy. What i'd love to see would be some ETAs. Not just "on the radar" or "maybe". But moreover downright ETAs for Updates.
And i'd sure like some words of explanation why they nerfed this or buffed that. Without any explanation the updates sometimes appear absolutely random. One day everything is fine, the next day, totally out of the blue, your whole style of playing was altered and you're not even told why. For example the Warrior Nerf (NO Discussion about this, just an example). If A-Net would have said something like "We had to weaken the warriors defense a bit because of the new classes in Chapter 3" or something along these lines. I'm quite sure, people wouldn't be quite as pissed as they currently are.

So in a long term point of view, lack of proper communication kills every game. Being left alone in the mist and shadows while the allmighty developers work their magic doesn't help much to fight the grief one might feel about certain things.

Give rough Dates for Updates:
Auction house will be there by September.
Guild Storage will be there by October.
If you know how long you'll have to wait, your time of waiting will be much much easier. Not being given a rough date and seeing how your beloved and much needed update shifts from "next update" to "yes yes, we're thinking about it" down to "Maybe next chapter!". This causes grief for many.

Keywords are:
Trade
Guild Storage
Party forming
Reconnect
Roleplay Districts

Give detailled explanations when altering a whole aspect of the game.
As it is now, you'll never know if your style wasn't completely annihilated over night during an update. And once you find out it was, you've got absolutely no clue as to why it was killed in the first place.
A short explanation would surely help the community understand.

majoho · Jul 17, 2006, 12:49 PM // 12:49

What's with the speculation and negativity all the time?

Aera Lure · Jul 17, 2006, 01:35 PM // 13:35

This is the problem as I see it (the quotes below). I dont see a solution, given GW's chosen game model. PvE remains interesting for only so long until the game becomes almost entirely PvP in order to continue with anything actually new. This is not to say I disagree with or fail to admire Anet's chosen path.

Anet worked too hard to limit farming which actually was one of the fun ways to spend time in PvE if you had 1-2 accounts full of maxed or nearly maxed characters. They also worked hard to limit running which for me, frankly, simply as a gameplay mechanic and way to spend time, was challenging if you aimed to really be good at it and was a lot of fun, irrespective of whether or not you actually earned anything doing that. You couldnt spend all you time replaying missions over and over with no net benefit yet they seem to have a single-minded desire to steer us in that direction. Then we have a concerted effort to limit wealth accumulation through constant nerfing and downgrading. PvE players have these sorts of things as the only reasons they play, when level caps and the like are as low and easy to acquire as they are. They've sort of shot themselvs in the foot as far as PvE is concerned, imho, much as I do understand their rationale. Cant see what they will do, if indeed anything, that's different from this road they are already on.

The one thing that might have done it was far more frequent game additions. A more dynamic environment, where you might be exploring old trodden ground and run across a new area, a new NPC with a quest that continues some aspect of the story, new monsters, a Charr resurgance and series of subsequent events - possibly like the holiday events, but not holidays events but major game events. At the very least monthly, some new story, mission and quest developments. They dont seem to have the resources to create quite that dynamic a play environment, but I am sort of at a loss to what else they can do.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 0mar

The biggest mistake Anet made was to make PvP and PvE integrated. If each side were seperated, then the PvErs could better weapons, more levels and more attributes. PvPers could get full unlocks, level cap and removal of the PvE advantages (armor switching, imba items and 4 weapons being a few).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sily Wabbit

one of my greater fears is keeping the game fresh. how many new skills can they come up with, how many skills can be duplicated? how many new pvp arenas can be made, how many new styles of missions can be introduced? how many new armor sets can be made, how many unique skins can be used? etc etc

I'm not seeing much life after Chapter 4-5 because this game lacks the system in which other MMO's use in which each new expansion increases the max dmg items can do, raises level caps, etc

Guild Wars doesn't have that. your never going to go past level 20. swords will always be 15-22. attirbutes will always be capped at 16 with runes. the game is going to get old, fast imo. there just won't be enough new content to make the game any more enjoyable then it already is. there can only be so much origionality, before stuff just seems to be reptitive and too alike to the point in which people just aren't gonna wanna play anymore.

Aera Lure · Jul 17, 2006, 01:37 PM // 13:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by majoho

What's with the speculation and negativity all the time?

Boredom, combined with a love of the game. I dont see it as negative. Constructive criticism is by and large a good thing. If nothing else, its something to discuss if presented at least somewhat objectively.

sassoonssamson · Jul 17, 2006, 01:43 PM // 13:43

I agree with some of the points

1) Even though I dont like grinding most of my characters became level 20 in a week or two. I would like in the 3rd chapter the cap limit to be raised from 20 to say 25 and some real challenge in achieving that

2) Also Acnet will try to bring something unique to a chapter so that people switch over liek auction houses or riding or flying ..

3) Ghost towns can be even felt in Factions Very diffcult to finish missions these days in some areas.

4) Overall I like Factions but the element of excitement and gameplay was better in Prophecies ( I remember that in Prophecies in the deset there were some missions that tooks days of trying to get thru , in factions maximum 2 trys were req to get thru

Hope Chapter 3 Nightfall will have enough gameplay

Snowman · Jul 17, 2006, 01:44 PM // 13:44

it sure is an interesting topic

Id rather be optimistic about future editions, Factions was great for me.. still got lots to do, yea I suppose I am bored with the pve but thats only because Im getting more and more in the PvP side, which provides infinate fun

I actually think the standalone thing as opposed to expansions will be a good thing!.. after all, a cheap expansion may not provide enough 'meat' to keep me going for 6 months.

Good luck them I say

WasAGuest · Jul 17, 2006, 01:47 PM // 13:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by majoho

What's with the speculation and negativity all the time?

It's a side effect of what Anet is doing to the game the above players enjoy so much. if Anet would be honest and true rather than apply marketing spin towards things, less speculation and negativity would show... yes I said "less" - there's always some who are negative, but that's just how we people are.

Example of marketing spin: Turning an obvious feature such as storage and calling it chapter content in an attempt to help the sales of an weak chapter; Factions being weak in content. The reason given makes no since to anyone with any since. Anet wants to sell more copies. Ok. What about people that already have Factions but not Prophesies? No storage upgrade for Proph, only for Factions. Anet said they were adding storage to Factions only; and they say that's a valid content upgrade to enhance sales... Riiight.

With the above said, it's smart that people (the players) are looking at the next chapter with concern. If Anet is allowed to rename a feature and call it content; then take their (Anet's) word that it is to help sales; then we can expect Chapter 3 and foreward to have weak content such as Factions does.

We can then expect to see the many features we've been needing and wanting to be spun into "chapter specific content" to push those chapters. I fully believe Anet will do this rather than work on real content that is playable. I hope with all hope I am wrong here as I really enjoy the game, but Factions is so poorly done and has so little to do, it's sad.

When the player base does not 100% enjoy PvP or competitive play, Anet needs to see that and adjust to their player base, not the player base adjusting to them... the players will just take their money and go elsewhere without much thought*... much in the way the "flameboys" always say "Then your playing the wrong game" or "go play WoW". They eventually will if Anet doesn't start seeing the bigger picture. - I have no intention of playing WoW and am in no way saying WoW is a better game, but with 6 million active and paying accounts, they are doing something right.

*Any smart or half intellegent business person will cater to the requests of their customer base. Attempting to merge PvE and PvP is not adding playable content; it's shortening the duration and amount of playable content by a huge amount. This type of merger also does not give any longevity to the game.

As the OP has also said, the past chapters will become void of life eventually. Henchies will be the only ones in the outposts and they still haven't made henchies 100% reliable to complete missions and bonuses in Tyria. Anet has also stated that additional "content" (read features) will be added to only new chapters to enhance sales. So new players joining in at Chapter 3 will have no real reason to go back and buy Chapter 1; or those coming in at Chapter 5 will have no real reason to go and buy Chapter 3, for example... which also makes no since; since that would be many lost sales for Anet.

Will Chapter 3 be any good? I still hold a little hope as it is the team that made Chapter 1. So we will see. I will not, however, be pre-ordering it. I will hold off and see what other's have to say.

sassoonssamson · Jul 17, 2006, 02:13 PM // 14:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by WasAGuest

When the player base does not 100% enjoy PvP or competitive play, Anet needs to see that and adjust to their player base, not the player base adjusting to them... the players will just take their money and go elsewhere without much thought*... much in the way the "flameboys" always say "Then your playing the wrong game" or "go play WoW". They eventually will if Anet doesn't start seeing the bigger picture. - I have no intention of playing WoW and am in no way saying WoW is a better game, but with 6 million active and paying accounts, they are doing something right.
.

You have hit the nail at the right place

I like PVE more and thats me and that how I will play I do enjoy PVP and GVG but at the end of the day PVE is what attracts me and FACTIONS was a dissappointmnet in this

lyra_song · Jul 17, 2006, 02:33 PM // 14:33

It is a very valid concern how the population will thin out across various chapters once we start reaching 3-4 etc.

Prophecies high level maps like Hell's Precipice will have even less players and thats simply NOT fun.

I think one solution is to release future chapters bundled with older chapters.

Imagine if Chapter 4 built up on Tyria, and came bundled with Chapter 1. It would bring players to chapter 1 and give them new content in that area.

Just an idea.

Spike · Jul 17, 2006, 02:39 PM // 14:39

I just don't get this obsession with raiseing the lvl cap. What difference does it make if your a lvl 20 fighting a lvl 28 mob, or a lvl 40 fighting a lvl48 mob. None. At least as far as I can see. The same applies to changeing the stats of the weapons, your will just be faceing mobs with more hp so it will make NO difference.

Was a guest was right when he said "When the player base does not 100% enjoy PvP or competitive play, Anet needs to see that and adjust to their player base, not the player base adjusting to them... the players will just take their money and go elsewhere without much thought*... much in the way the "flameboys" always say "Then your playing the wrong game" or "go play WoW". They eventually will if Anet doesn't start seeing the bigger picture. - I have no intention of playing WoW and am in no way saying WoW is a better game, but with 6 million active and paying accounts, they are doing something right. " He was wrong about wow, it DOES NOT HAVE 6 million active and paying accounts. I have seen NO proof of this besides PR releases from blizzard which are by no means proof.